League Rules and "Cheesing"

I have a few questions regarding the league rules and what is considered "cheesing". Two times in the past few games opponents have called me a cheeser after our games and I would like to understand why because I dont believe I am doing anything wrong. First off, I run the West Coast Offense and I primarily base my scheme around short quick pass plays (slants / out / ect)... I have always been a passer in Madden games and subsequently the majority of my plays are pass plays thought I run the ball atleast 10-15 times a game. I will be the first to admit that I run the majority of my plays from two formations (Near and Far). Apparently according to my last opponent that is considered cheesing in itself even though I run 15-20 different plays throughout the game. I also run plays from Snugs Flip, Bunch Swap, Spread, ect.. At no time do I ever use a specific play more than 20% of the game (or even 10%). Apparently its cheesing as well to dump the ball off into the flats? I admit I do dump the ball into the flats often because it seems every opponent i play wants to drop back into pass coverage instead of play up on the line, wouldnt an nfl quarterback not check down to the flats if an opposing defense was playing him soft and covering the deep routes? I know on defense I have much more of a problem with players rolling out and chucking up the long ball and catching it with a defender just standing there in zone than I ever do covering the flats. Anyways just wanted to get some clarification because I dont see anything wrong with my play style and am bothered that opponents are calling me a cheeser when I dont understand why. TY

"abuse of the flat" was a big complaint last year... and throwing a SWING pass to a RB in the flats is COMPLTETABLE 99% of the time (this is beacuase the player assigned to cover the flats SITS 3-5 YARDS DEEP in the heart of the zone)- you throw the SWING pass when the RB is 4-6 yards behind the Line of Scrimage (LOS) - this generally makes a 10 yard MINIMUM seperation that a defender (who is in position) must close - and if that defender doesnt make a tackle - its often a BIG GAINER... where it gets abusive is when player does this play TOO much (paticulkarily when they have a spd RB they are throwing too)...

Over-using a SPECIFIC route although not illegal in terms of our UNIVERSAL SIM RULES - perhaps a rule should be warranted -

where i see a potential problem is that players who use this kind of pass as a BLITZ COUNTER may be forced into breakn a rule because of the dicates of the defensive BLITZ more so than there OWN play-calling,,,.

In the end... I 100% RESPECT YOUR FOR INVESTIGATING THIS... AND I UNDERSTAND HOW A NEW PLAYER WOULD BE TOTALLY DUMB-FOUNDED BY THIS... but OVER-USING ANY 1 PATICULAR ROUTE I FROWNED UPON - ALTYHOUGH NOT AGAINST THE RULES (but look it to be shortly - we should clarify this)


perhaps a new addition to rule #1 could read:

When atempting a pass to a SPECIFIC route this must be considered within the play-calling %...

although this MAY fix this problem - I TRUELY BELIEVE THAT A PLAY CAN BE HUGELY DIFFERENT JUST BECAUSE OF THE COMPLEMENTARY ROUTES THAT THE NON PRIMARY RECIEVER RUNS (and i am not a huge passer - i would never have this issue) NEVERTHELESS I CAN SEE AND RESPECT how such a rule worded the way i have would elliminate legitamately different routes solely based upon what non MAIN recievers are doing - I SEE THIS AS HIGHLY RESTRICTIVE AND NOT THE ANSWER...

DOES ANY1 ELSE HAVE A BETTER POTENTIAL SOLUTION?

definitely gotta give the man respect for asking others opinion on cheesing, very cool.

i the same type of offense as you, dodger, just a little more conservative as i set my passes off the run. or vice versa in which i'd be in your scenario if they are aggressively defending it the run. funny this is i got accused of the same thing last year in a super bowl game by some guy who ended up dropping out anyways. i burned him with the run almsot the entire 1st quarter, occasionally throwing in some pa's which earned a couple big gains.

we went back and forth til he started man blitzing, cover 1, double te. i countered it with slants and screens until he softened up and i went back to the run to finish him off. he, like most people who get frustrated turned one dimensional and start passing the same predictable routes over and over.

personally, i love when people have only a few plays. makes it easier to audible your d and adjust when you recognize it, and set them up for that user pick.

i don't see how your style is cheese, and the only thing i consider cheesing is intentionally exploiting the ai. like greener mentioned, the flats were a big problem last year. this year it seems zone awareness is very lacking at times, and locomotion is creating some issues with miss steps which will hopefully be addressed in the patch. some people are sore losers and will cry cheese because they can't adjust their d, or figure out your pattern. thats just my opinion on it, i hate losing too...A LOT, but always respect the guy on the other end who plays a smart game, not an exploited one.

I'm new too, but I don't think what you do sounds like a Cheeser. I usually consider cheese as something that either doesn't happen in real football, or something that does happen in real football but works too well because of AI stupidity. While the flat route falls into that second category, it's not something that can't be fixed via audibles or user control. I've played so many players (some on this site) who try and use speed RBs and throw to them in the flats for a majority of their plays...defending it is as simple as switching to the man covering the RB or assigned to the flat, and then shooting the passing lane for a pick.

I think rather than adjusting their defense people are too quick to call "Cheese".

First off thanks for responding people I do appreciate it! I think the biggest reason these guys have called me a cheeser is because I base my scheme off two formations, Near and Far. Both formations shows up as 2 wr 2 rb 1 Te pre snap though one has a 2 wr on one side one has wr on each side. Even though I have about 15 plays total I run from the two formations, people seem to seem to not be able to tell the differences in the plays I am calling. I know when I am playing defense I am concentrating on the player I am usering not watching what pattern every WR is doing every play so I could see how some people could come to the conclusion that only a few different plays are being run but thats basically just lack of paying attention to detail imo. Anyways thanks for some clarification guys I appreciate it!

I have done work on the west coast book and kno that the near and far formations are great. Wuth different combo routes and stuff. Now I have a problem with dumping it off to quickly for 2 reason.

1. If I'm not blitzing and u can do a 3 step drop back dumping the ball off shouldn't occure unless u go through your reads. Rb's are never the primary receiver on pass plays unless its a hb screen. If I'm blitzing throw it to the hot read.

2. Catch and shoot is a big thing for me. Not doing a drop back wether it is 3 5 or 7 and throwing into the flats when the defense AI doesn't react well. Being as tho there is no nanoing here how can u defend that. Not man or zone can. And as far as I kno takings a lineman off the line to defend the flats is illegal unless u hot route them.

That's my issue. Hitches slants outs drags that allow the route to develope after a 3 step dropback since I thought there was an auto dropback this year. I don't have a problem with short routes long as u do a dropback

guys this isnt madden 10. Flats are fixed!!!!


I love when people keep trying to throw to the flats cause im just gonna call a play that covers them and pick 6 that shit. Or tackle the back for a loss. Just cause you have a hard time stopping something doesnt mean its cheeze.

Also... a lot of people stack the box and blitz often. this leaves you very vulnerable to the backs in the flats. AS IT SHOULD. To anyone who thinks throwing to the flats is cheeze, I invite you to an unranked game. You can go to the flats every single play and we will see what happens. Seriously if you think its cheese I will show you how easy it is to stop.

I also make reads BEFORE and DURING every play. If I see a guy wide open I dont say to myself "gee the back is wide open in the flats but im gonna throw it over the middle to my double covered WR so people don't think I'm a cheeser" I see an open guy I throw it, no hesitation. If it happens to be the same guy that gets open 5 times in a row thats the defenses problem not mine. Any NFL qb would do the same thing.

As for running primarily out of 2 formations, I really dont have a problem with it as long as you mix up the plays.

I agree with what others have said. A lot of people cry cheese when they dont know how to stop something.

IMO the only new rule the madden group needs right now is something to address the people who drop back 15+ yds on pass plays. This is something you NEVER see in NFL, or even college. You see passes to the flats all the time.

agreed.. and the flats is a pass alot of qbs in madden can complete if you cover the wrs .. so why wouldnt u hit them?

Crying cheez when u can't stop something is what ppl usually do...ppl need to do is define what is cheeze and what is not...disagreeing with someone offensive style or philosphy is somethin different. Me and tomer had a discussion earlier at how I didn't like or respect his offense...I didn't call it cheese caus its not just a style of offense I don't agree with but its his style. Ppl are quick to throw out the word cheese just like ppl are quick to say I love u...rediculous hahaha

haha def

i have played dodger, i did call him a cheezer. but that's because i thought running the same routes over and over as well as using the same formations all game were illegal, which apparently they aren't? in this case i think they should be ruled against because no nfl teams runs the same patterns all game or from the same formation, teams would read the routes etc, the ai is not able to do this. such as quick outs, slants, etc. (i.e. real life cover 2 defense vs quick out = pick 6/ madden cover 2 defense vs quick out = 5 yard gain)

ezweightloss wrote:i have played dodger, i did call him a cheezer. but that's because i thought running the same routes over and over as well as using the same formations all game were illegal, which apparently they aren't? in this case i think they should be ruled against because no nfl teams runs the same patterns all game or from the same formation, teams would read the routes etc, the ai is not able to do this. such as quick outs, slants, etc. (i.e. real life cover 2 defense vs quick out = pick 6/ madden cover 2 defense vs quick out = 5 yard gain)

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT - repetitve play calling is illegal and was 1 of the 1st rules we made in the group/... but this rule has evolved...

If a player is forced to run a play because of a paticular BLITZ that a DEFENSE is dictating - that should not be allocated to the REPETITVE PLAY CALLING RULE (because the # of times he runs his BLITZ COUNTER PLAY is dictated by how much the defense runs the BLITZ)...

but i think the repeitive play calling rule must stand - and is 100% enforciable regarding pass routes... example if your outside reciever is doing posts patterns ALL GAME - it shouldnt matter what formation he is running them from and what the other routes recievers are doing (who are not even being passed to)... perhaps the rule needs furthur clarity...

i'm not a blitzer, i play a bend don't break defense on a majority of downs. so that would not be a useable excuse for dodger when he played me.